The Australian Department of Defence and UAP - the latest

Protocols

In June 2019, I asked the Australian Department of Defence if they had "...any current guidelines concerning the reporting by Department of Defence personnel of Unidentified Aerial Phenomena?" Their response was "Defence does not have a protocol that covers recording or reporting of UFO sightings."

Later, on 16 June 2021, I submitted an FOIA request to the Australian Department of Defence. "I wish to obtain copies of emails generated by the Department of Defence between 1 January 2021 and 16 June 2021, which refer to the terms "unidentified drone;" "unidentified aircraft;" "Unidentified object;" or "Unidentified Aerial Phenomena."  On 13 July 2021, the Department's response, in short, was "No records were found."

The latest

Chief of Airforce, Air Marshal Mel Hupfeld

Today, the Australian ABC news carried an account concerning statements about UAP made by Chief of Airforce, Air Marshal Mel Hupfeld. This arose in the context of a Senate Estimates Committee hearing.

Senator Whish-Wilson

The ABC reported, that Green Senator Peter Whish-Wilson asked Hupfeld a question about the June U.S. Office of the Director of National Intelligence's preliminary UAP report. Hupfeld responded that while he had no formal knowledge of the findings in the report he was aware of the report via media accounts. 

Air Marshall Hupfeld stated that:

"...he had not seen any reports of 'Unidentified Aerial Phenomena' - or UAPs - in Australian airspace."

"I'm not familiar with, nor have seen any reports or information regarding UAPs in an Australian airspace context, and there's no air-force-led task force that looks into the phenomena."

Asked whether the Jindalee radar system could detect UAP's he replied:

"It's not possible for me to determine whether the JORN would see something like an unusual airborne phenomenon, without knowing the construction materials, and other performance parameters of such an object, if indeed it was an object."

Update: 2 November 2021

A transcript of the relevant Senate Estimates Committee, dated 27 October 2021 has been published.  The relevant section is as follows:

Senator WHISH-WILSON: I'm not sure exactly who to ask to respond to these questions, because they may well not have been asked before. I was wondering if I could have someone senior from the Air Force— particularly a pilot, if that's possible. 

CHAIR: Who knows how to fly a plane! Senator Payne: We'll do our best to find you a pilot from the Air Force. I'll call the Chief of Air Force; there's a plan! 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: The Chief of Air Force would be great, if that's possible. Senator Payne: He's a pilot; I've seen him fly. 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I am a pilot. I used to fly aeroplanes—not currently now. I think I've got the information you might need, pending your question. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: I know we have close ties with the US. We share intelligence. My questions relate to the release of the report on 25 June 2021 by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence, Preliminary assessment: unidentified aerial phenomena. This is an issue that has been raised in Congress; the Department of Defense has submitted a report. It's become a significant matter of public interest. I suppose my first question is: are you aware of that report? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I'm not formally aware of the report. I think there was an article in the newspapers and commentary about that at some stage. But I'm not quite sure of the content of the report. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Okay. Just as a matter of interest, what questions did you think I was going to ask? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I thought you were going to ask questions about aircraft, but it sounds like you're going to ask questions about UFOs. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: We'd be very interested to hear your views on this. Yes, it has been reported in the media extensively both here and internationally. I'll just read you a few statements or the executive summary from that report. It basically talks about UAPs as being something that the US Department of Defense is taking seriously, and that the Pentagon has a taskforce assigned to better understand the data interpretation of recent sightings. The report says: 'UAP clearly pose a safety of flight issue and may pose a challenge to U.S. national security.' Then it goes on to talk about the 144 cases that the Pentagon looked at. Only one was clearly explainable; the others remain unexplained. It says that, after carefully considering the information, the taskforce reported that UAPs largely witnessed firsthand by military aviators were 'collected from systems that were considered to be reliable.' It went on: 'Most reports described UAP as objects that interrupted pre-planned training or other military activity.' Could I ask whether the Australian Air Force or the Australian military also have a taskforce looking at UAPs? Is this something that you're familiar with at all in your brief? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I'm not familiar with nor have I seen any reports or information regarding UAPs in an Australian airspace context. There's no Air Force led taskforce that looks into this phenomena.

WHISH-WILSON: We don't do any monitoring of this at all? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: There have been no reports that I'm aware of, Senator. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: No informal reports from pilots or across other military activities? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: None from any aircrew or aviation organisation that I'm aware of. The only experience that I have in this was over 40 years ago when some reports were made and we launched Mirage aircraft. The phenomena turned out to be errors on the radar screens in our normal civil air-traffic control system, but no physical objects were detected. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Does the characterisation of the DOD, in relation to their report, of both intent and advanced technology concern you? Basically, they're saying they can't explain what these things are, but they would like to better understand them. 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I can't answer for another sovereign nation. That is a matter for the US and the Pentagon and the Department of Defense in the US. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Would it be possible for you to see if, across the other services, there has been any kind of reporting system in relation to this in Australia? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: Certainly, I can take that on notice. But I feel confident that, as the airspace control authority within Australia, if there had been any detections or items such as this, I would have been aware of them. But I can take that on notice to double-check. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Okay. Typically, would something like Jindalee be able to pick-up fast-moving objects, or is it more designed to look at ships and— 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: Senator, the Jindalee Operational Radar Network is designed to detect aircraft and some ships. I won't go into the details of the nature of that detection, as we would then be getting into very classified areas. It's not possible for me to determine whether the JORN would see something like an unusual airborne phenomenon without knowing the construction, materials and other performance parameters of such an object, if, indeed, it was an object. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: As a pilot, have you seen any of the video footage that's been released by the US military? It's unclassified and it's been reported on by either the New York Times or the Washington Post. Even The Conversation here in Australia, which, as you know, is quite a respectable, conservative media outlet, has written a report. They're not saying they agree that these things may be more than aberrations, but they are saying, 'Finally, there's a mature conversation now happening around UAPs and we're trying to better understand them.' 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: Through professional curiosity, I did look at some of the videos that were attached to those media reports. They were interesting but not compelling to me. I don't believe everything that I read in the media. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: No, nor do I. It's certainly something we learn in Canberra. It's just interesting. Do you think it would be possible for pilots to spoof that kind of thing? 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I'm not sure what you mean by 'spoof'. Are you talking about the— 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Obviously the video has come from US Air Force pilots. I think there are 80 different sources, and the DOD and Pentagon are taking this seriously. 

Air Marshal Hupfeld: I'm not really able to comment on that. There are too many variables to even form a view. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: Thank you for that. If you could just take that on notice, that would be excellent. 

Senator Payne: I can say with some confidence that after over two decades of participating in the Senate estimates process this is the first occasion on which in any capacity I have had the opportunity to observe a conversation and a question-and-answer session on such an issue. So thank you so much for bringing it to our attention. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: My pleasure, Senator Payne. I do notice our key ally is taking this very seriously. Senator Payne: I heard you. 

Senator WHISH-WILSON: It is now emerging as a matter of public interest. So I'm glad you appreciate that. Senator Payne: I listened with great interest. I'm glad we could find you a pilot.

Update: 4 November 2021

On 28 October 2021, the Senator was interviewed by Brian Carlton on Triple M, Hobart, Tasmania, 107.3FM. They discussed the Senator's appearance on the Senate Estimates Committee of 27 October 2021. I noted the following points:

1. The Senator thought that as the U.S. and Australia are close allies that we may be doing something to look at UAP.

2. The Senator was surprised that the Chief of Air had not read the June 2021 Office of the Director of National Intelligence UAP report. 

3, 20 years ago, a friend of the Senator's who served in the Special Forces in Iraq and East Temor, told the Senator a story. Early one morning, he was on an exercise on a boat, at an undisclosed location. The boat was followed by a metallic object. In July 2021, after the DNI report came out, the Senator was in Western Australia and had a beer with his mate. Talking about UAP his mate asked if he remembered him telling the Senator about the UAP from 20 years back? The Senator did and then decided he would ask some questions in Australian parliament.

4. The Senator will put some detailed questions to  follow up his Senate Estimates questions.

5. He believes someone in the Australian DOD should have spoken to US sources about the subject. 

Office of the US Secretary of Defense FOIA AAWSAP response

Background

On 30 April 2018, Australian researcher Paul Dean, published a blog titled "The Advanced Aerospace Weapons Systems Application Program."  Paul had received word from an individual, whom Paul referred to as "...someone who claimed to be in a senior defense program leadership role."

Whereas, we were all referring to the "secret Pentagon UFO study program" as the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program (AATIP,) this individual told Paul that the program's name was actually the Advanced Aerospace Weapons Systems Application Program (AAWSAP.) This led to the uncovering of more information about AAWSAP; whose full correct name, turned out to be, the Advanced Aerospace Weapon System Applications Program.

FOIA request

Having this inside knowledge, Paul immediately submitted a request under the US Freedom of Information Act (FOIA), to the Office of the Secretary of Defense/JS FOI Desk. He requested:

"...any electronic or hard copy records that include: mission statements, program overviews, program aims, fact sheets, program briefs for commanders or other senior leadership, program histories, contract information,  and other general information regarding a program (either still running or was running in the last 12 years) within the Department of Defense. The name of that program is "Advanced Aerospace Weapons Systems Application Program" (AAWSAP) or extremely similar. It was located possibly in the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA), but I would like other DoD agencies checked. I saw a reference to this program in a register of DoD programs some years ago, so I do believe it exists or existed."

The DoD response

Almost two years later, the DoD responded in a letter dated April 14, 2020.  The letter came from the Department of Defense FOI Division, 1155 Pentagon, Washington DC. It was a "final response" to Paul's FOI request. Part of the reply, stated:

"The Office of the Under Secretary for Aquisition and Sustainment (USD A&S,) a component of the Office of the Secretary of Defense (OSD,) reasonably believes  their office does not have records in their files that are responsive to your request. Therefore a search was not conducted. You provided additional clarification of your request and a search of the Office of the Under Secretary for Intelligence (USD(I)) a component of OSD, conducted a search of their records systems based on the additional information you provided. After thorough searches of the electronic records and files of USD(I) no records of the kind you described could be identified. We believe that these search methods were appropriate and could reasonably be expected to provide the requested records if they existed." I image this letter below:

Note: Paul's current residential address is no longer the one shown above.

Comment:

So, the very first known FOIA request concerning AAWSAP, to the Office of the Secretary of Defense/JS FOI Desk has essentially recorded a "no responsive records held" reply.  I am aware of other such FOIA requests, such as my own to the OSD/JS FOI Desk, which are in the pipeline. Paul's response gives us little hope of a positive reply.

New FOI result - Australian Transport Safety Bureau

Hi all,

Introduction:

Following my recent Freedom of Information Act request to Air Services Australia, (click here to read the results) I submitted a separate request to the Australian Transport Safety Bureau (ATSB.)

Who is the ATSB?

According to their website, "The Australian Transport safety Bureau (ATSB) is Australia's prime agency for the independent investigation of civil aviation accidents, incidents and safety deficiencies. The ATSB is governed by a commission and is entirely separate from transport policy makers, industry operators, and from transport regulators such as the Civil Aviation Safety Authority (CASA.)"

FOI Act request:

I asked for:

"1. Any documents held by the ATSB, on the subject of "unidentified flying objects" (UFO), including a search of the ATSB's OASIS aviation occurrence database, or other similar databases."
2."A copy of all papers dated 1 January 1983, on an  Air Accident Investigation file, file reference V116/783/1047 titled "DSJ-Cape Otway to King Island 21 October 1978-aircraft missing."

Results;

I have already posted the details of documents I received as per request 2 (the Valentich disappearance) (click here to read my post on these.) This post will therefore report on the documents received as per part 1 of my request above.

I received copies of the following "Occurrence detail reports." Each report was a two sided proforma filled in with very little information, as follows:

1. 2 Jul 1969: 196901691.

"Burn marks rep on 2 golf courses reported as poss UFO landing. RAAF notified." Sydney, NSW.

2. 31 Jan 1969: 196902473

At 21:25 hrs at Diamond creek, Vic.
"A (deletions made under section 22 of the FOI Act) of Rosanna rep sighting a UFO white in colour moving very fast in a straight line."

3. 12 Jan 1975: 197502943.

At 9:09hrs at Albury, NSW 15W. "UFO sighted on radar at 20000ft in CTA - Not possible to identify."

4. 16 Apr 1977:  197703195.

At 22:45hrs near King Island, TAS. A Cessna 401 pilot on a charter flight from Melbourne to Hobart. "UFO report from pilot - passed to RAAF for study. CFT beacon abeam." Altitude 7500ft. At night (dark). Wind speed 6-10. VMC conditions.

5. 21 Oct 1978:   197802563.

At 19:12hrs near Cape Otway, Vic. VH-DSJ Cessna 182L. "Plt reported UFO then rough running eng. Tx ceased - Acft missing." Flying Moorabbin Vic to king Island Tas. VFR. 4500ft. Visibility 15km. Dusk.

The ATSB provided me with a copy of the Aircraft Accident  Investigation Summary report. Also a copy of an article by a Rolf Rebner titled "Valentich Plane Disappearance: a seismic solution."

6. 22 Sep 1979:  197905600.

At 7:05hrs near Banka Banka, NT. "Object in area. Search acft found burnt trees and white  ash but no object. (Sneaky Martians?) Misc - UFO consisting of white light trailing smoke sighted by three witness. F27 plt reported white."

7. 19 oct 1979:  197904657.

At 19:45hrs near Broken Hill, NSW. An F27 MK 200. Flight Broken Hill to Adelaide. "Acft, however no known acft in area. Misc- F27 crew sighted UFO whilst on climbout. Flashing white light similar to strobe on high flying." Night (dark). Wind speed 6-10.

8. 7 Apr 83: 198300234.

At 14:27hrs near Manly West, Qld. "No known acft or balloon activity in area. Inside radar coverage but no radar return. UFO reported silvery object size of Cessna without wings flying from east to west at 2000ft.

9. 8 Nov 1998: 199804923.

At 15:51hrs 28km NW Perth Aerodrome, WA. "The pilot reported an unidentified flying object, bright red/orange in colour 100ft below and travelling very fast as the aircraft passed 9,000ft. The object was approximately 2 meters across and the pilot believed that it may have been a model aircraft." 8900ft.

10. 25 Jan 2011:  ATSB telephone notification form.

23:29hrs Mackay, Qld. "Reported  seeing a bright orange light with a dark centre appearing from the horizon, turning 90 deg and took off into the distance at high velocity with no sound. The object was captured on the iphone. (2 photos and a movie.) I referred him to the UFO hotline."

Previous post:

In a post dated 18 Jun 2012 (click here to read) I provided the results of a 2004 FOI Act request to the federal Department of Transport and Regional Services. This request resulted in a response from Rob Graham, Director , Safety Investigations, and utilised the OASIS aviation occurrencee database of the ASTSB.

Comparing the 2004 and 2012 FOI Act requests reveals that of the occurrence detail reports mentioned in this current request, numbers 1-9 were also provided to me in 2004 (although with less details.) Only number 10 of the current request is new, perhaps due to its date of 2011.

It is also interesting to note that the 25 Jan 2011 report was referred to a UFO Hotline, presumably that run by AUFORN. A check of the 2011 reports on the AUFORN website database (click here to look at hundreds of their report) failed to locate any such report made to them. I contacted AUFORN directly and Rob Frola advised me he had never heard of this report.

In conclusion:

I have now completed my FOI Act requests to the two main Australian Government agencies which are likely to receive UAP reports from civilian airline pilots. As you can see they responded with limited data.

Prior to the closure of the RAAF's UFO investigations, there were dozens of pilot reports to the RAAF. The question therefore remains as to whether the number of UAP observations by pilots has declined in recent times, or whether pilots simply do not report sightings of unusual objects in the skies?

I'd appreciate hearing from any blog readers who are also pilots.